F Rosa Rubicondior: How Christian Fundamentalists Lie To Us

Sunday 19 August 2012

How Christian Fundamentalists Lie To Us

It's never a pretty sight to watch a fundamentalist in melt-down, hilarious though it might be, and I don't normally carry over spats in Twitter into this blog, but this one is too good to pass up.

Of course, you can't draw a general conclusion from a specific example, but this illustrates what can happen when religious (in this case Catholic Christian) fanaticism crossed the boundary between a sincere attempt to convince people of the truth of a firmly-held superstitious belief, and a blatantly dishonest attempt to fool people, having run out of ideas for doing it honestly and with integrity but lacking the moral courage to admit to not having any evidence to use when asked for some.

It also illustrates rather nicely I think, the point I made in an earlier blog - If Creationism Is Science, Why Do They Need Tactics? - to which no creationist has yet been able to produce a coherent reply.

It also illustrates the parasitic viral nature of the religion meme in one of its more pathological manifestations.

These tweets on the right were posted by a fundamentalist who claims to be a trainee Catholic priest but who already has a reputation for dishonesty and is something of a figure of fun in the community of people who follow and post to the #Atheist / #Atheism hashtags on Twitter. He is know by the user-name @Sacerdotus. The tweets were all sent between 16:41 and 16:53 on 19 August 2012 BST.

The first thing to notice is the the link @Sacerdotus includes (sacerdotvs.blogspot.com) does not link to any such challenge, nor is there any reference to one on the site it links to. It is merely a link to his blog.

@Sacerdotus has access to my blog (Rosa Rubicondior) and regularly posts comments but has never seen fit to post his 'challenge' there, nor have I ever received a challenge to him via email. I have never seen a Twitter tweet referencing this 'challenge', although, as @Sacerdustus knows, I had blocked him several months ago having tired of his infantile and dishonest 'debating' tactics there and in accord with the policy I state in my Twitter bio, and only unblocked him yesterday, so maybe @Sacerdotus chose to hide his 'challenge' by tweeting to me when he knew I wouldn't receive it.

But perhaps I am crediting @Sacerdotus with too much intelligence in assuming he would know that to issue a challenge, one needs to communicate that challenge to the person you are challenging, but, even for a trainee Catholic priest it seems unlikely that he would really be that stupid.

Which just leaves us with one realistic explanation: @Sacerdotus is lying again, and hoping again to trick people with deception because he knows that truth and honesty won't work.

And this of course illustrates what Francis Collins, himself a Catholic Christian, means when he says in The Language of God "Young Earth Creationism has reached a point of intellectual bankruptcy, both in its science and in its theology. Its persistence is thus one of the great puzzles and great tragedies of our time". I would also add moral bankruptcy to that charge but then that is to be expected of those who have abdicated personal responsibility in favour of obedience to the diktat of a character in a book, who then provides a convenient scapegoat in the 'God Sez!' excuse.

@Sacerdotus' abandonment of even a pretence of honesty and integrity and his descent into the playground tactics illustrated above in lieu of evidence, reason and logic in civilised debate, shows how religion can pervert the human mind and turn it to it's own purpose at the expense of personal integrity and dignity, just as a virus perverts the host it infects and uses it for the benefit of the virus at the expense of the host.

One wonders just what else sufferers from this psychotic delusion are capable of perpetrating on mankind if they ever regained the power they once held over us in the appropriately-called 'Dark Ages', if this is the sort of response you get to a polite request to validate an assertion or provide supporting evidence for a claim of fact.

Further reading: It Could Never Happen To Us - Zombies Controlled By A Parasite.

[Update]: To see how this subsequently developed and how @Sacerdotus, who turned out to be Manuel de Dios Agosto who was expelled from St Joseph's Seminary, NY because of his behaviour there, and who now spends his days trolling the Internet harassing, abusing and intimidating people, including threatening them with violence, under a variety of guises, see:

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  1. Rosa, I am assuming your eyes work otherwise you would not be able to blog. How did you not see the DEBATE tab next to CONTACT on my blog??? It is obvious you are distracting. Why make a fool of yourself? Why the lies and dishonesty?

    1. Will you be finding the moral courage and personal integrity to explain to the world why you didn't tell me about the 'challenge' you are lying to the world about?

      And why you decided to try that tactic rather than use honesty?

      Will the world be told soon why you decided to use tactics rather than substance to defend your superstition and how you knew you would need to?

      Or would you prefer to continue to discredit your god and your 'faith' rather than lose face and admit that you know you have no factual or logical basis for your claims?

    2. Rosa, go to the timeline and see for yourself. I invited you to a debate. The tweets are there with date/time. Why make a fool of yourself with this distraction? Why lie when everyone can see for themselves on twitter, a public forum?

      You did not reply so I taunted you like Elijah with the prophets of Baal. You even posted the taunts here!

      I've always wanted to debate you, but you blocked me which showed you don't have the intellectual confidence to do so. I merely seek to make an example of you by destroying your pseudo reasoning which is a facade for bait.

      I don't use theology to debate Atheists, so accept my challenge. Don't be afraid.

    3. Why do you keep lying saying I never told you about the challenge? Here is the proof:

    4. Twitter has me in jail, here you go: http://rationallyfaithful.blogspot.com/2012/08/debate-rosarubicondior-vs-sacerdotusr.html

    5. Because, as you know, having been told several times, you sent that whilst I was off line and when you knew you were blocked.

      I'll leave others to judge why you needed to employ that dishonest tactic in view of your subsequent hysteria. It's probably too obvious for me to need to spell it it.

    6. >I don't use theology to debate Atheists, so accept my challenge. Don't be afraid.<

      As you knew before you posted that, I have accepted your 'challenge' subject to agreed terms and conditions, so I'll just leave it there as a 'tribute' to your 'honesty and integrity'. It doesn't bode well for your conduct in any debate though, so I hope you manage to find a modicum of personal integrity between now and then.

      Hint: Try to be grown up and not quite so obviously disingenuous and dishonest.

    7. Sacerdotus.

      Just in case you forgot to read your Twitter tweets, and to avoid being accused of using your tactic of issuing a hidden challenge, may I draw your attention to my blog setting out the terms and conditions for our debate. You may read it here - Debate: Is There Scientific Evidence Only For The Christian God?

      Not wishing to take an unfair advantage of you, can I recommend you read 'So You’ve Decided To Be An Apologist For Christianity' where you will find lots of helpful hints.

  2. That sick man reminds me of how dogs behave. As long as the owner has his dog leashed, he (= the dog) often barks at other dogs very loudly and ostentatiously. The same dog unleashed would be rather silent.

    Unfortunately Manny/Sacerdotus seems to be leashed to his many delusions of grandeur so that he dares to bark at you so intensively. And if God/Jesus doesn't want to assist and help him, the FBI and CIA certainly will.

    *Now I feel I have to shake my head and exclaim: "Oh, my God!". But then I realize that I'm a non-believer and atheist, so I decide to be silent and not involve God in this mess.*

  3. That's the problem Helmer the FBI and CIA are too busy with all the scammers online now but Manny/Sacerdotus should be investigated big time, many good people are donating to this scammer. We are sure glad Rosa that you are tackling this head on, you are saving not only money for innocent people but souls as well. Keeping you in our prayers Rosa

    1. Hello Manuel!

      Still pretending not to be yourself? I think everyone interested now knows why you need to so you just look sillier by the day.


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